Steve Mickley interviews former AIBD President David Pillsbury.
Recorded 2019-12-10
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Transcript
Steve: [00:00:00] Good afternoon and welcome to, Let’s Talk Certification, a live recording of a podcast program hosted by the American Institute of Building Design.
[00:00:07]I’m Steve Mickley AIBD is Chief Staff Officer, and I’m happy to be here hosting this month’s show.
[00:00:13] Every month a guest CPPD shares the approach that they’ve used to prepare for the Certified Professional Building Designer exam or the CPBD exam.
[00:00:22] Normally that would be someone who’s taking the most recent version of that exam.
[00:00:26] Today we’re going to stray from that path a little bit.
[00:00:30] This month we have a very special treat. David Pillsbury has been a CPBD since 2004.
[00:00:36] He’s been President of AIBD and held a number of positions along the way.
[00:00:40]Since 2004; that’s like 105 years ago if you’re a dog, by the way.
[00:00:46] So anyway, I’ll be interviewing David a little differently.
[00:00:49] We’ll still be learning why he pursued building design certification like normally, and I’ll be asking him to describe his experiences taking the exam, but that is going to be quite different than it is today because of having taken it 15 years ago.
[00:01:03] But I think you’re going to find that interesting.
[00:01:06] Then, just like always, I’ll hopefully get him to share some advice that he might have for those of you that are seeking accreditation yourself, plus more.
[00:01:15] And in addition to having CPBDs to interview each month, I try to focus on one aspect of the CPBD candidate handbook.
[00:01:23] And if we have time, I’m going to focus on page 38, the test development page. How those questions came to be and how we got to our cut score.
[00:01:32]we try to leave plenty of time for the audience members to ask questions.
[00:01:35]as soon as they come to mind, type your question into the question box and we will squeeze those into the discussion as quickly as possible.
[00:01:44] The final edited version of each monthly podcast is available on a dedicated website, AIBD.org/podcasts .
[00:01:52] Unfortunately, this is not the kind of program that qualifies for continuing education credits, although I do tend to pick up one or two career tips with every broadcast.
[00:02:03] So pay attention.
[00:02:05] And one last thing before we begin, I must remind everyone that the opinions expressed during today’s broadcast are those of the participants and not necessarily those of the AIBD.
[00:02:15] And as always, we must be mindful of the AIBD antitrust statement, which is found in the institute’s Book of Rules.
[00:02:23] So, David, thank you very much for taking time out of your busy schedule managing a firm that has what now? I think 45-50 people in it.
[00:02:32] David: [00:02:32] That’s probably closer to 60, but we’re in the middle of pulling it all together.
[00:02:36] A couple of firms, so yeah, 45 to 60 there between the two of them.
[00:02:41] Steve: [00:02:41] And that’s Keesee Associates in Apopka, Florida.
[00:02:44] We were fortunate enough, here at AIBD, that the staff was able to attend their Thanksgiving dinner. There were so many people there.
[00:02:51] We just kind of squeezed right in and I don’t think you guys even knew we were there.
[00:02:55] David: [00:02:55] We always know you’re there.
[00:02:58]Steve: [00:02:58] So let’s start off with why did you become certified?
[00:03:03] David: [00:03:03] Well, that’s simple. I wanted to be the best residential designer I could be and certification has proven that to me.
[00:03:15] Steve: [00:03:15] Okay. Can you expound on that? Is there some examples of how it has?
[00:03:21] David: [00:03:21] Sure. what it means to me to be certified, and how maybe it’s affected my career being certified is giving me the opportunity to say, bridge the gaps among my clients, builders and engineers. fill in the gaps i should say.
[00:03:35] The building designer creates a relationship where the client comes to depend on our specialty to guide them through this complex process of building a home, without unnecessary frustration or fear of the unknown.
[00:03:49]They depend on you to be the authority and being certified certainly has gone a long way in assisting with that.
[00:03:58] Steve: [00:03:58] Do you remember how many years you were actively in the building design profession before you became certified?
[00:04:05] David: [00:04:05] Oh, that’s calling up my age here. Probably 20 years.
[00:04:09] I started drafting and started freelancing in 1984-86 timeframe. And I didn’t get into certification until just before I got certified.
[00:04:21] So, a lot of fieldwork and practical experience out there. Doing it wrong a couple of times, learning from it. I’m sure a lot of us have done that.
[00:04:32] Steve: [00:04:32] So what kind of projects were you doing before you were certified and did that scope kind of change once you got certified?
[00:04:41] David: [00:04:41] Yes. It’s funny you mentioned how it changed.
[00:04:44] We have a term for those of us who have sought out some classical training too, that are pre-ICA work versus post-ICA work.
[00:04:52] But same thing goes with certification too.
[00:04:55] You can see the difference in work that was done. I was a drafter for a company here and there, and when you set out on you own, you’ll draw pretty much anything that comes by.
[00:05:05] being in my twenties, not really business savvy, a lot of it was all residential, additions and home plans. But it wasn’t till you get your teeth sunk into some of the construction and getting out in the field and working with your contractors and clients and seeing how much more you need to know to stay relevant in what we do.
[00:05:27] Steve: [00:05:27] And did you go to school for this? Did you come from the field? How did you come about into the career?
[00:05:34] David: [00:05:34] I’ve, well, I’ve always been an artist. I started drawing when I was a child, but, drafting in high school.
[00:05:40] My first drafting job I was still a junior in high school and I’ve been doing it ever since.
[00:05:46]I’ve never done anything but what I do except for you fill in, you want to learn something, you go and learn that part.
[00:05:52] But I’ve always been drawing plans.
[00:05:54]that’s been my real love is to pull it together and solve the design problem.
[00:05:59] That’s always fun.
[00:06:02] Steve: [00:06:02] Wow. You started, I mean, basically you learned the craft, not learn the craft, but you got started learning things in high school and you went right from there to like operating your own drafting firm.
[00:06:15] David: [00:06:15] Yeah, I would go light on the word firm. You draw a plan, you pay your rent, draw a plan.
[00:06:22] And, again, I was in my early twenties, so yeah. To the point I have my mentorship, comprised of just the people around me , the authorities, that if I was drawing something and need to know how tile was set, or, you know, what did trusses do to the top of the wall.
[00:06:42] And you go and you just kind of observe or pay attention , participate I meant to say, in some of those activities, you just learn it along the way.
[00:06:49] Someone will take you under their wing and say, son, that’s not how you do that. So then you don’t do it next time.
[00:06:55] So no, it really was the hard knock school.
[00:06:58] I don’t recommend my path to anyone really. There’s much easier ways to do it.
[00:07:05] Steve: [00:07:05] And I think you’ve always lived in Florida, right? Or at least as long as I’ve known you.
[00:07:09]David: [00:07:09] I’m from here, born and raised, from Clearwater and spent a lot of time in, a little bit further North up in Citrus County and Ocala, Marion County for a good bit of years and I joined Mike over here i n Central Florida, Orlando Apopka area back in 2005.
[00:07:27] And, when he was looking to transition from a pure production based, firm where he supplied building plans and lot releases for the production builder.
[00:07:39] So he wanted to evolve into more of design oriented. So of course what do you do?
[00:07:45] You reach out to your AIBD buddies and say, Hey. You’re a little business up there at Ocala you’re complaining about this and that, or clients, why don’t you come join me?
[00:07:55] So I did that.
[00:07:56] So that’s got me here. and we’ve been building this through the rough times in 2009 and coming out the other side pretty shiny.
[00:08:04] Steve: [00:08:04] Cool. The timing though is if you got certified in the early two thousands, I remember in Florida there were some major hurricanes in the 1990s that maybe it didn’t change so much the way they’re building houses, but definitely changed the way you prepare the set of working drawings.
[00:08:23] David: [00:08:23] It did, it did.
[00:08:24] I remember, I was in Ocala for Andrew. I mean, although the impact was much further South, just the panic before they realized how building code would change.
[00:08:34] We had this thing called, I think it was deemed to comply, was a little pamphlet that you had to actually draw connectors on your plan.
[00:08:41] Which did you ever have to do before? I mean, we’re talking about building set of plans. It’s two sheets and you threw the first one away after you put the flooding. So, yeah, there was quite a bit different amount of details that had to go on the plan and then it kept evolving.
[00:08:56] Then they’d call it something else with standard 10 or SST D this year or whatever. And then the code just keeps evolving and you have to Stay relevant with it, especially if you have a small firm.
[00:09:07] If you don’t, if you’re not sitting in a big firm where you’ve got to hire somebody to take care of your code or do your QC or those kinds of things, if you’ve got a one to five or even 10 people, you have to be responsible enough to have your clients trust you, that trust in you that you know how to put that set of plans together.
[00:09:27] It’s a pretty important deal.
[00:09:30] Steve: [00:09:30] So all these changes happening about the time that you’re starting to pursue certification do you recall that, as things were progressing in the industry that you needed something to differentiate yourself to show that you knew these changes and that’s why you seek certification?
[00:09:51] Or was it the other way around that, that having the certification is what really prepared you for all these changes?
[00:09:58] David: [00:09:58] I have to think it was a little bit of both because I had so many years prior just figuring it out. And then like you mentioned storms and things through the mid nineties or so.
[00:10:11]There was a need. There was a definite need that you couldn’t just call your local building official and say, Hey, what do I gotta put in this wall section?
[00:10:19] You really had to have something that was marketable. Let’s just say you had to be able to put the confidence into your clients that they’re giving you the biggest sum of money they probably put out. I’m talking about the home, not the plan necessarily.
[00:10:35] And they’re trusting you to prepare a set that they don’t run into a lot of problems.
[00:10:40] It was, I don’t want to call it fear, but it was, it was like, Hey man, I need to know what I’m talking about. This seemed to be the most practical way to do it. And I trusted the people that I was members with in AIBD.
[00:10:56] And, I still talk to many of them today and see how certification affected their careers and I liked the work they were doing and I knew, man, this is what I need, and that’s when I got serious about it.
[00:11:11] Steve: [00:11:11] Okay then describe the process that you went through 15 years ago to become certified. It’s quite different than it is today.
[00:11:20]David: [00:11:20] yeah, it is. more paper then, it took me probably a little longer then. I’ll spare you how long it took for me to overcome the fear of the actual exam.
[00:11:33] I was never a really great test taker. So once I got over how much that blew my mind, again, AIBD friends coaching me and said, come on man, just go take the test and get the guide and you go through it.
[00:11:46]if you just trust in the materials and read through it, do all the preparation necessary. Schedule it and take care of it. It was a little bit longer. I recall it being two days, wasn’t it Steve? I think it was a two day, three days.
[00:12:02] Steve: [00:12:02] Possibly three.
[00:12:02]David: [00:12:02] Actually it could’ve been three days with the art with the drawing problem and the history and all that.
[00:12:08] But it was a serious test, was something that I took serious and actually had to take a section of it again, the structural part.
[00:12:16] I would attribute that to apply ng the practical knowledge you get over the years.
[00:12:22] And that happens too, with contractors and their exam, where you apply everything you’ve learned in the field of the test and it doesn’t really answer the question.
[00:12:30] So whether you got where you needed to go, you didn’t get the answer right.
[00:12:34]and so that made me have to take the structural part, a portion of that over again.
[00:12:38] But today, with it online, I understand it to be, a little bit different for the proctors and attendance and where you have to go to take it.
[00:12:49] You don’t have to travel several cities over to sit and take the exam. It’s quite a bit better. That’s nice to see that it’s evolved with the times.
[00:12:59] Steve: [00:12:59] So out of the 10 parts that you had to take in two days, let’s say it was two days, I’m pretty sure it was at that point. You only had to take that one part over again.
[00:13:10] David: [00:13:10] I remember it specifically. I know what I did wrong. It was a deflection problem.
[00:13:14] I had to figure a beam in some situation, and I used a moment calculation instead of a deflection calculation and that’s what I was talking about, the experience.
[00:13:24] The beam would work in real life, but it wasn’t what they were asking me.
[00:13:27] Steve: [00:13:27] Right.
[00:13:28] David: [00:13:28] It was devastating to me. So it’s like, ah, I’ve got it right, but I didn’t get it right.
[00:13:32] So, that’s what I mean, just trust in the materials. It’ll get you there.
[00:13:36]Steve: [00:13:36] Nine out of 10 in the first sitting though, that’s still pretty impressive. So, now it is, all those parts have been condensed into just one, three hour exam.
[00:13:48] There’s 175 questions. 150 of them actually count. 25 questions are what we call pretest questions, which are the ones that we’re trying to do the standard setting for, and, hopefully be able to weave them into future exams and make it to where they do count.
[00:14:06] So that’s part of the ongoing process of maintenance, of the exam.
[00:14:11]Probably a good time for me then to go ahead and address that section on page 38 that this process all started with, a job analysis.
[00:14:21] It was used to create the framework, or the blueprint, for our CPBD exam.
[00:14:26] We performed several workshops, each one addressing a different aspect of the test development process.
[00:14:34] The first workshop was held July, 2015 where we launched the job analysis itself. It was a study, I forget how many questions there were, but as I recall, it took a couple of hours to go through the survey that we created.
[00:14:49] It turned out to be in depth research involving subject matter experts or what we call SMEs in the candidate handbook.
[00:14:57] And they help define the tasks, the knowledge, and the skills that most building designers are doing on a daily, monthly, weekly, yearly process.
[00:15:06] Questions were set up in a way that they would ask you how important something was and how often you did it.
[00:15:12] For example, there might be some things that you do on a daily basis, but they’re not very important, like unlocking your front door, or locking it when you leave. That would be more important probably.
[00:15:23] Other things would be like tax preparation, which is very important, but it’s something you do only once a year.
[00:15:30] So all that analysis was compiled and that’s where we created page 39, 40, 41, 42, I don’t know. It’s four or five pages of the candidate handbook where it talks about each of the knowledge domains and it breaks them down into sub domains and then tells you how many items or IE questions on the test that come from that section.
[00:15:51] So it’s the best we can do for right now as a study guide to show you what it is that you’re going to be questioned on.
[00:15:58] But once we had that blueprint and these knowledge areas, then we got a new set of SMEs and put them together writing questions, items, and then there was a complete new group.
[00:16:13] I believe at the end there was 60 or 70 volunteers that ended up working on the development of this exam that we have now.
[00:16:20]They went through and reviewed each of the questions and we had consultants that we hired, they call them psychometricians.
[00:16:27] They all usually have PhDs after their names.
[00:16:30] They get really excited about numbers and surveys.
[00:16:34] So the universe works wonderful in that way because there’s a lot of people out there that think that some things that you don’t like to do are play to them.
[00:16:42] So always be looking for those people and don’t do the things you don’t like to do. Hire them because they live for it.
[00:16:50] So crunching these numbers where the guys we looked for. And so then we put together a standard setting exam. It was also three hours, but it was 225 questions.
[00:17:01] So we really tested the candidates that did the standard exam right to the edge.
[00:17:06] I believe, I don’t know what that works out to, but it didn’t seem like much time per question.
[00:17:12] And then all that information was then compiled and studied by a different psychometrician who then got together our last set of subject matter experts who looked at the performance of each of the items.
[00:17:25] And if something performed badly, let’s say, everybody got it right. That question was thrown out.
[00:17:32] Or if there was a question that everybody got wrong. That was thrown out.
[00:17:35] When I say everybody, nearly everybody, there was a certain percentage that was used.
[00:17:41] And so the questions that were leftover, each one of the volunteers then were asked to go through and create, like a rating of the question as far as how difficult it might be.
[00:17:52] And so, through that process, there’s formulas that are used and I believe it’s a modified Angoff I think is the name of the formula that we use to come up with our cut score.
[00:18:04] But, it comes to about, I think 65%, maybe a little more, but 95 of the 150 questions that count have to be answered correctly in order to pass the exam.
[00:18:16] And, unlike the way it was when David took the exam, which was broken up into 10 parts, and you only had to retake the part that you failed, now that it’s condensed into three hours, whenever you don’t get the 95 questions or more right then you have to retake the whole exam again.
[00:18:36] So thanks David for letting me squeeze that into the interview here, and…
[00:18:40] David: [00:18:40] It’s good stuff.
[00:18:42] Steve: [00:18:42] …Hopefully provide some input there.
[00:18:46] So would you encourage someone else to become certified and why would you do that?
[00:18:54] David: [00:18:54] Of course I would. Yeah. I would. If you’re serious about your design business, I think it’s the responsible thing to do as a professional for the same reason you’d expect your medical professional to be certified.
[00:19:07]Your clients, they’re trusting you to perform an expensive service without actually seeing the product that they’re purchasing ahead of time.
[00:19:16] They’re trusting you to know what they don’t know.
[00:19:19] And I always like to quote, just as it relates to your question, Lindsey Buckingham said, “if you’re any good at all, you can be better.”
[00:19:27] Steve: [00:19:27] That’s a great quote. I’m gonna have to get that one from you. The… I lost my train of thought with such a great quote.
[00:19:37] David: [00:19:37] Sorry.
[00:19:37] Steve: [00:19:37] So, can you give us some examples of like where it’s made a difference? Any particular projects or clients that come to mind where you were able to really use the certification as a way to close the sale or win the job, let’s say?
[00:19:51] David: [00:19:51] Well, I would say, where it’s made a difference being certified for me anyway, just seeing the confidence level on the face of the contractor, who knows you’re speaking to a building official on behalf of his client, and he’s trusting you to have the knowledge to hold your own.
[00:20:10] That’s been one of the biggest things that I hold a certification out to be is making you the authority in what you do.
[00:20:18]Knowledge is not power. It’s what you do with it and how you apply it that becomes useful to you.
[00:20:24] So just reading a bunch of structural books doesn’t do anything, but taking the exam and proving yourself and taking those skills and putting it to work in your plans and marketing that is a whole package.
[00:20:36] It’s yourself. It’s your work.
[00:20:38] Clients see that and it puts you in the position. I mean, you’ll have building officials calling and saying, Hey, how did you address this? It happens.
[00:20:47] It’s a good place to be, so you’re not constantly having to prove yourself all the time.
[00:20:53] For me.
[00:20:55] Steve: [00:20:55] For you.
[00:20:56]I’m glad you added that because everybody seems to have a different reason. And that’s what makes these podcasts so much fun is to be able to dig in and find out why and how.
[00:21:10]So, as president of AIBD, probably not the greatest, but certainly in the top five of monumental changes were led by you.
[00:21:27]You restructured the way the whole organization was governed. I don’t know where I’m going with that, other than, the association has been growing greatly.
[00:21:39] We’ve been able to make a lot of changes rather quickly.
[00:21:43] Prior to that, we only had a group of like 50 people that made the decisions twice a year and things seem to be more nimble and easily…
[00:21:53]David: [00:21:53] I think I know where you’re going with that. Not everything that has to be done is popular.
[00:21:58]We’re a 50 plus or 65 year old organization. And we kept getting caught up in too much regulation. It took too long to do anything. We weren’t able to adjust to the times as they were changing.
[00:22:15]And just kind of loosening up how things are done from the business side of it to allow us to incorporate relevant educational opportunities or splitting the conventions or conferences into different venues across the country instead of just one and travel.
[00:22:38] There was a lot of reasons for why just kind of a restructure had to happen and just kind of reboot it for the times.
[00:22:47] I mean, you just can’t keep adding RAM to that old iBM 33 . You gotta jump out and get new equipment sometime.
[00:22:56] That’s sounds silly, but we really needed to position ourself to be able to grow further faster.
[00:23:05] Steve: [00:23:05] Well, as it turns out, you were ahead of your time, our time, the time.
[00:23:09] As it, through the industry, made changes since then.
[00:23:12]The National Kitchen and Bath Association and the National Association of Home Builders, I think have finally, this year, are implementing the changes that they started trying to implement into the changing of their governance structure almost about the same time or shortly thereafter.
[00:23:28]I remember the day, sometime in January, 2015 in Las Vegas, we held that last meeting of the house of delegates, and that was the same meeting, I’m almost sure that, the group voted to spend the $35,000 that it was going to take to do this first job analysis.
[00:23:46]Something that had never been done in the building design industry.
[00:23:49] That was the beginning of all the changes that reflect all the way down to this certification program and our desire to become ANSI accredited.
[00:24:00] We’ve spent somewhere between 75 and $100,000 developing the exam and creating new policies and procedures.
[00:24:09] And I don’t know if, prior to those changes, this organization would have been able to have that much foresight.
[00:24:17] David: [00:24:17] That was it. That’s it in a nutshell. There was too much committee work and without getting bogged down into committee speak, yeah, it’s much more nimble now to be able to move and adjust when necessary.
[00:24:29] Steve: [00:24:29] And I think that this has happened since our last podcast, but just to let everybody know, the National Council of Building Designer Certification, which is the group that AIBD relies on within AIBD to govern the certification program, they have released the funds and hired consultants to do two huge tasks.
[00:24:50]One is to create a practice exam, and in order to do that, it has to go through nearly all the same steps that we had to go through to create the exam that we’re using now for certification.
[00:25:02] So soon there’ll be a practice exam. It’ll be a 50% scale exam.
[00:25:07] It’ll be hour and a half long, or it possibly will be able to do it as many hours as you want.
[00:25:13] It might be adjustable from that aspect that you can set the timer and try to challenge yourself.
[00:25:20]But also what they’ve done is released some money for us to apply for ANSI accreditation and the exam.
[00:25:26] And that’s really where this began.
[00:25:27] I was president of NCBDC back in the early 1990s, I believe, or late 1990s and the desire to become accredited started to evolve back then.
[00:25:41] And it’s taken us now what, two decades to finally get our foot in the door.
[00:25:46] David: [00:25:46] Been a long road and it’s gonna make a big difference once this process is completed and holding the certification high.
[00:25:55]And I’m sure you could speak to that.
[00:25:59] Steve: [00:25:59] Well, what I want to do is as having been president of AIBD, and that was what four or five years ago now where do you envision our industry going and how does all this fit in?
[00:26:13] David: [00:26:13] Well, that is a good one.
[00:26:17]It’s pretty subjective and there are plenty of opinions.
[00:26:19]I think if we’re honest with ourselves, we have to either adjust to the ever changing technologies, or hire those with the knowledge to keep us relevant with the tech.
[00:26:33] And I think that just speaks to our personal businesses or firms and how we want to relate.
[00:26:40]It’s really difficult to speak to how we want to change it in the future.
[00:26:44] I mean, we can, with accreditation, I can imagine a few ways that having it prop up the certification, the accreditation prop up the certification, making it more marketable and desirable for designers to achieve.
[00:27:04] I think is the whole point of it.
[00:27:09] Steve: [00:27:09] You’ve got a large firm that you’re a part of.
[00:27:10] What are you seeing as the new people in the industry come in? What are you seeing them lacking in knowledge or skills? Where can we do better as an industry?
[00:27:21] David: [00:27:21] Wow. That’s another one. It’s pretty much anything to do with that. The hands on portions of it.
[00:27:28]A long time ago if you needed to learn something, you went out and stood beside the professional or the giant in the industry and watched them do it and learn.
[00:27:37] I think things could be moving too fast. Maybe not.
[00:27:41] I think there’s also an opportunity to communicate to young professionals, or professionals in general, that being a plumber or an electrician is still a noble profession.
[00:27:53] I think trades are important to us and will always be important to us.
[00:27:58] I’d like to see apprenticeship again just to expand our industry. And to knowing whether it’s commissioning our designs into the next iteration of energy compliance.
[00:28:13] Steve, you and I have had conversations about that, but there’s a lot of different ways we can go in the future.
[00:28:18] And it takes the steps. It’s taken us so long to get this far with the ANSI portion. It’ll be nice to see, when the rubber hits the road, how we can apply the things you’ve dreamed about for the last decade.
[00:28:32] Steve: [00:28:32] Well, we’ve got a question that was typed in by Larry.
[00:28:36] He says, when will the practice exam be ready?
[00:28:38]I always used to tell my clients that when they would ask me when the plans would be done and be like, design is a process, not an event.
[00:28:47] And so creating an exam is a process, not an event.
[00:28:51] So it’s not something, unfortunately, Larry, we can say it’s going to be done on this date.
[00:28:55]But I can tell you that the funds had been earmarked, and the consultant, and we put out an RFP, and we’ve hired the consultants, and now we got to get the process going.
[00:29:05] So just stay tuned.
[00:29:07]I will report, on a monthly basis through the podcast as that progresses.
[00:29:13] Anybody else that has any questions for myself or David, use the question box and type them on in.
[00:29:20] Richard is asking, it can take several months to over a year?
[00:29:26] Possibly so.
[00:29:27] We started the, well, we started the job analysis for the current exam in 2015 or, no, I guess by then it was 2016.
[00:29:36] So it took three years to develop the exam we have. But the good news is that we’re using the same blueprint that comes from the same job analysis.
[00:29:45] And when we enlisted those SMEs to write questions we only needed a couple hundred and they came up with somewhere between six and 700 questions.
[00:29:54] So we’ve got a pond of, a pool I should say, of questions to pick from.
[00:29:59] It’s just a matter of getting through these holidays and watch your inbox because you don’t have to be certified to be a volunteer in this process.
[00:30:08] And it’s important that we get people who didn’t volunteer, to help us develop the exam we have now, because it needs to be a fresh set of eyes and new opinions to be able to review the questions that we’re going to be using for the practice exam.
[00:30:22] Otherwise, the, ANSI assessors may feel that we tainted the system in some way.
[00:30:28] So we’ll be looking for people after the first of the year to help us sift through those questions and do the evaluation and the standard setting, just like we did in the real exam.
[00:30:38] So keep your eye out for those emails. And that includes you too, David.
[00:30:44] David: [00:30:44] Certainly.
[00:30:47] Steve: [00:30:47] So what kind of advice would you have for those people seeking certification today?
[00:30:55]David: [00:30:55] If they’re actually seeking certification, I would do it sooner rather than later.
[00:31:00]That was one of the struggles I had is just, when do I do it? When is it going to be relevant?
[00:31:05] Just forget about all that. Just go do it.
[00:31:07] I mean, you probably know a good portion of what you need to know and what you don’t, you’ll pick up in the materials and apply yourself.
[00:31:16]I’m a C student and I passed it.
[00:31:19] So I’m sure there’s a lot of people out there quite a bit smarter than me that can apply themselves to an exam like this and in turn apply it to their profession.
[00:31:27]There’s so much to be had when you have the confidence of being an in command professional in front of your clients.
[00:31:37]You may not want to talk to a room full of people. Talking to a client, sometimes, depending on who that client is, can be just as intimidating.
[00:31:45] But there’s something to be said about confidence and being on top of your profession. For me, it put me there.
[00:31:53] Steve: [00:31:53] Earlier in the interview you mentioned ICA. A lot of people may not be familiar with what that is.
[00:31:58] David: [00:31:58] Sorry about that. That’s the Institute of Classical Architecture.
[00:32:02] There was some time back in, and I think it was also 2000 where a few, AIBD members went up to New York and went through a training process up there on specifically the classical architecture.
[00:32:18] And if you’re not familiar with this Institute these are rock stars of architecture, classical architecture and have done some very amazing things.
[00:32:26] And we set up a program for AIBD, at the time, Florida piloted this program, we had, I think it was four or five different sessions, and it was like a weekend and a different city every couple of months.
[00:32:39]I think it lasted a year the first time through it, four or five sessions.
[00:32:45] What you learned, it was career changing.
[00:32:49] You went back to your office after taking these classes and you just kind of shake your head at your work and go, man, what was I thinking?
[00:32:56]Once you understand how to proportion something or just scale and right kind of massing and just all those little things.
[00:33:02]Here’s the real thing is when you apply it to absolutely everything and then don’t tell your clients you’re using it, even if you’re doing a contemporary house, you could still use good scale and massing.
[00:33:13]And they’ll just look at it and they’ll say, Hey, there’s something about that that is just awesome and I can’t put my finger on it.
[00:33:20] And you’ll know what it is because you know what you went through to get there. It’s a thrill. It was great.
[00:33:25] Steve, what did you get out of it?
[00:33:28] Steve: [00:33:28] The reason why I bring it up is, have you gotten other certifications in addition to the CPBD and was the CPBD the first one that maybe spring-boarded you into these other programs?
[00:33:43] David: [00:33:43] Yeah, it was. You kind of get hungry for it.
[00:33:47] There’s, probably the next one after that, not next one. But there’s Certified Green Builder.
[00:33:52] When that started to be, becoming more relevant and necessary to know how to put something together that was sustainable, the NAHB offered a program in green and sustainable practices so that certification.
[00:34:09] And then when all the rage happened for lead paint and you become a certified renovator; that’s a tough one. There’s a lot of responsibility that comes with that one. So you’ve got to know what you’re doing to market that one .
[00:34:23]Certifications, if you’re not going down the path of architecture, you want to fill your toolbox with the tools necessary to provide the best product you can for the people that you’re selling your services to.
[00:34:37] And at the time that’s what I was doing. We were doing a lot of renovations and some of them were classical renovations.
[00:34:42]If someone asked you the question, Hey, what do we do with this or that? You have an answer for it and you have it, how to apply it and use it, whatever notes go on your plans. Again, it just goes back to that authority. If you need to know it, go get it.
[00:34:55] It’s all out there. It’s all available to you. And there’s a couple of other little things out there, but those are the big ones, I guess.
[00:35:05] Steve: [00:35:05] Oh, fantastic. Yeah. I had thought you had gone out and gotten some other certifications along the way,
[00:35:12] So do you have any questions for me?
[00:35:18] David: [00:35:18] I wasn’t prepared to ask any questions, but I was sure answering them.
[00:35:21] But no. I think someone already asked the question on the practice exam.
[00:35:26] I was curious when that was going to be available and ready to start marketing because we’ve got some of our staff here that’s interested in pursuing it and being members and contributing even on the local level and some of the chapters here in central Florida.
[00:35:42]Taking a bigger role in that.
[00:35:44] So yeah, no, the information on the when and wheres is probably my biggest question.
[00:35:51] Steve: [00:35:51] Oh, I would say, tell them to stay tuned to the Monday Minute. Hopefully we can report the good news soon.
[00:35:58] But, my goal would be to launch it sometime into 20 20. Just, it’s hard to say when we’re going to be done until we get it started.
[00:36:06]David: [00:36:06] At one time we were spending a lot of time with our students and speaking to the college groups certification. Is there any interest or has any progress been made in trying to tailor the certification to what they’re teaching? And some of the campuses, like some of the state college, you remember, we did that with Seminole State where they were looking at the exam and tailoring their curriculum to it.
[00:36:39] So students could go through their classes and learn what they needed to. And I mentioned trades earlier, whether it’s construction management or whatever, and by the time they’re done with their classes, the goal was to be prepared enough to further their career as ability designer.
[00:36:59] Steve: [00:36:59] Well, we certainly make the job analysis available to as many universities as we can get to take it. Most of them, though, depend on local industry advisory groups where they will create their own curriculum and put it in front of these groups once, maybe twice a year and get feedback.
[00:37:22] And a lot of times these groups are made up from the companies that they’re, oh, what do you call it when the placement people within the college, there’s probably a term, a title for that person, but, the ones that are helping the students get the jobs after they’ve learned the information and gotten their degree .
[00:37:38] So that’s what I’ve experienced, that we provide them the job analysis that really gives them a nice outline. But they’re looking on a broader scope and not just building design, but architecture in general.
[00:37:49]Possibly architectural engineering. Or architectural technology is becoming a popular title for some of the curriculums.
[00:37:57]Not quite so much as architectural engineering, but it is growing.
[00:38:01]Where AIBD hopefully can get a foot in the door in the secondary and postsecondary schools is that we have just taken the lead and will be chairing the national Skills USA architectural drafting competition, starting in 2020.
[00:38:20] So if you’re not familiar with Skills USA, they’re the ones who create a state, a County and national competition for just about every trade you can think of.
[00:38:34] There’s hairstyling, there’s cosmetology, there’s carving, computer repair. Mechanics, air conditioning, masonry, all the way drafting, you name it, whatever.
[00:38:48]Remember when we used to have trade schools in America? Skills USA is trying to return us to that.
[00:38:56] And they’re providing an opportunity for the students to compete and get themselves in front of a public audience. And AIBD has been named the chair of their architectural drafting competition.
[00:39:09] And our goal is, is to help our chapters trickle that down because like I said, there’s a state competition that comes before that national competition. The only people that compete nationally in these, I think it was 109 different competitions or different trades that they have competitions for.
[00:39:26] The only way to compete nationally is to win your state competition. So what we’ll be looking for in the near future as well as SMEs to help us build a practice exam is people to go out and volunteer at your local level with Skills USA and get involved with the trades, the students that are becoming our future trades people, judge their competitions, possibly even come up with the problem that the students will be solving as the competition.
[00:39:53]More information on that coming soon.
[00:39:56] And we’ve also been developing a, not really a certification, but like a technician certificate program where we’ll go into a school and take a look at their curriculum and then, offer a capstone exam at the end.
[00:40:13]We use the same software that we use to deliver the CPBD exam, and we’ll go in and their students can take a test that we host based on the information that they’ve learned in their high school drafting course, let’s say.
[00:40:28] And at this point I gotta admit, it’s really mostly just giving somebody a test on plan reading. Not really creation of plans. But the tests that we have, shows them a floor plan, ask them questions about the floor plan, and shows them a wall section, a roof plan, site plan, and all the different elements that make up the construction drawings.
[00:40:47]So that’s been launched. It’s still in development, but hopefully that’s another connection we can make with our new position at Skills USA.
[00:40:59] David: [00:40:59] That’s great. Because that also, so thinking of for hiring people too, and look into , to check boxes or what you asked them, what we’d like to see when we want to hire somebody.
[00:41:10]And I can see where the skills USA and some of these certificate programs could assist in something.
[00:41:15] There are so many things on our plan that we draw that aren’t shown on the plans. For instance, the tolerance as you leave for say, trim materials that go next to another product or something like that.
[00:41:26] It’d be nice to have these certificate programs and finishes so that we can just not have to take our plans, stop at some point, and go off to another discipline.
[00:41:38] Because we’ve seen that go bad sometimes, too, to where things get redesigned and then there’s confusion.
[00:41:43] So, do you see those certificate programs acting in that capacity at all or are they gonna be more for their root kind of base knowledge program?
[00:41:54] Steve: [00:41:54] No. I see the certificate programs being more specialized, just like you’re envisioning.
[00:41:59] David: [00:41:59] Okay.
[00:42:01] Steve: [00:42:01] So whereas the CPBD exam is more broad stroke of the 145 different knowledge and skills that our job analysis identified as a building designer.
[00:42:12] For example, the BIM-R training that we have now is a certificate program that we offer that specialize just in the aspects that you need to know to be BIM manager in the residential design field.
[00:42:26] David: [00:42:26] Right.
[00:42:29]Steve: [00:42:29] Richard has asked the question regarding the ANSI accreditation, how soon do we expect to see the first stages of the finalization?
[00:42:36] I leave tomorrow for Washington, DC to go through a two day class that ANSI puts on, on how to apply.
[00:42:43] So then there’s a preliminary application that you submit and if the preliminary application is approved, then you have a certain timeframe before you have to put in the actual application.
[00:42:59] So I don’t remember… I know that they’d publish it, but I don’t remember what that time frame is.
[00:43:03] But we’re holding off putting in that preliminary application, which is just an application that basically puts you in their data system.
[00:43:10] It’s like starting up your Amazon account, but then it asks you three or four qualifying questions.
[00:43:17] That helps them determine whether or not this is a type of certification that even warrants their type of accreditation.
[00:43:24] So you answer those three or four questions, you submit it, and when they accept it and they don’t tell you how long that takes, but I can’t imagine it taking too long.
[00:43:33]I’m wanting to say it’s 90 days, then the clock starts ticking that we have to finish and prepare our full application.
[00:43:39] The full application is quite extensive. I plan to learn more about it in the next two days. But my recollection of seeing it is, we’re talking a box full of paperwork that we’ll be putting together for them.
[00:43:52] And then, once they accept the application and deem it to be complete, they will send two assessors to our office and they’ll spend a day, maybe two, going through all of our policies and procedures, all of our files, quizzing the staff and investigating our management procedures.
[00:44:13] And the whole process, as I understand it, for this as ANSI accreditation, as far as the management and the development and delivery of the exam is concerned, is that it’s gotta be a system that is always getting better.
[00:44:28] So we have to prove to them, how we’ve written policies that make it to where we can find our flaws, within ourselves, and then what do we do then to overcome these flaws and make the process better.
[00:44:41] So that along with following the standards that have been established for certification. So, like I say, I’m going to take the class.
[00:44:50] That preliminary application, based on what I learned in the next two days, three days, that preliminary application, hopefully it’ll go in and the first quarter of 2020, and then whatever that timeframe is, we’ll have the final application in from there.
[00:45:04] And then it’s all in ANSI’s hands going forward.
[00:45:07] I know that, If they do find any deficiencies, I believe the 90 days kicks in again, that we can resolve those deficiencies.
[00:45:15] If it turns out that it’s the type of deficiency that we have to like change our bylaws or something for us now with the new structure that David helped develop for us, that only happens once a year.
[00:45:28] So then we can apply for like a six month extension of that 90 days in order to handle those kinds of situations.
[00:45:34] So again, I’m speaking on what I’ve read, over the next three days I’ll be going through the final, or the formal, training on how to communicate to you what the process is.
[00:45:46] So Larry has a comment here. I asked professionals how tall is a residential 8 foot wall. Most do not know. The answer is eight foot one and an eighth and there’s a reason.
[00:46:01] Okay. I think Larry’s pertaining to…
[00:46:03] David: [00:46:03] I know where he’s going. I was going to shout out 97.125. I’m typing it in as I speak.
[00:46:09] You got to get it right. If you’re going to do it, do it right. Good job, Larry. I love that.
[00:46:18] Steve: [00:46:18] And a two by four is not two by four, is it?
[00:46:22] David: [00:46:22] No. The one inch peg does not fit in the one inch hole. That’s a fact
[00:46:31] Steve: [00:46:31] Well, what was it that I heard? That’s a, somebody that just started a Ted talk on the Fibonacci numbers.
[00:46:38] I can’t remember his name, but he did a Ted talk on the Fibonacci numbers and he led off and he says, you know, my math teacher didn’t like me from the beginning because she said that, a square peg won’t fit in a round hole. And he said, well, if the diagonal is less than the circle or the diameter, it will in fact fit in a round hole.
[00:47:00]Well with that, I think we’re running out of time. We’ve only got a few minutes left.
[00:47:05] I appreciate you taking the time again, David, thank you so much for being here to help our future CPBDs.
[00:47:14] David: [00:47:14] No problem. I appreciate it. And feel free to reach out if anybody’s got any real life questions they want answered.
[00:47:21] Steve: [00:47:21] And so one last thing before we go, I want to send a shout out to one of our education providers, Ron Blank and Associates, who has organized their library of complimentary, prerecorded webinars in a way that aligns with that list of knowledge domains on page 39 of the candidate handbook.
[00:47:40]If you go to Ron Blank and Associates website, search AIBD Courses by Division, and you’ll find the length from both RonBlank.com and GreenCE.com which is owned by Ron Blank.
[00:47:55] A knowledge domain breakdown, including the examination content weights, is found in the test content section of the CPBD handbook.
[00:48:03] Like I said, starting on page nine the 147 knowledge statements are classified into four domains: business administration, business practices, design processes, and building design, which the last one is the heaviest weighted with 111 of those 114 knowledge areas.
[00:48:20] So I encourage you, if you haven’t already, to download the candidate handbook at AIBD.org/certification and closely review the test content section.
[00:48:29] Then visit RonBlank.com, click on online courses in the menu bar, and then in the center of the screen, you’ll see a tab that says “by AIBD division”.
[00:48:39] And what they mean is by the divisions of that content domain list in our candidate handbook.
[00:48:46] So with that, I want to thank everyone for being here.
[00:48:49] It takes each of us to improve the lives of all of us. So thank you for your presence, your attention, and your commitment to building design.
[00:48:57] With that, we’ll see you on the next podcast on the second Tuesday of January.
[00:49:04] Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.